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BTHoops Junior

Joined: 10 Jan 2004 Posts: 348
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:28 pm Post subject: Patience Please |
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I know some on the board are disappointed by an 0-2 start for the Minutemen. To those who are disappointed, let me stress the importance of patience.
The 2009/2010 UMass Minutemen have 5 freshman and 2 transfer student athletes who are building blocks of a solid Atlantic 10 basketball program. Harris, Gurley, Gibbs and Correia are the only returning players who play any meaningful minutes.
The 2009/2010 Minutemen are extremely young. While some may not want to hear it, this team should not be judged on wins and losses until the 2011/2012 season when this year’s freshman class is in their junior year. The UMass program right now should be judged by how they improved throughout the season. They should be judged by their work on the practice court, improvement across a 30 game schedule, their improvement in the weight room or in Putney’s case at the breakfast, snack, lunch, snack, dinner and snack tables. :)
The class of 2013 is Derek Kellogg’s first recruiting class. While Gibbs came in as a freshman under Kellogg, he was signed by Travis Ford. Two transfer student-athletes in Big City Bailey and Sean Carter also classify as Kellogg recruits, but much like the class of 2013 freshmen, this is their first year of completion playing at UMass. I think if you look back at any number of student-athletes who have either transferred to UMass in the past or who were forced to sit out a year as a freshman non-qualifier, it will take these transfers some time to get themselves acquainted to playing game conditions again.
We’re all excited about our freshman class, but unfortunately, we are not Michigan with the Fab Five and we are not a high major who can re-load with top 25 McDonalds’ All-American talent every year. I do not want to upset anyone here, but we will never be that. We are in a non-BCS conference with no I-A football, a bad TV contract, an overall apathetic fan base and average facilities. We are the very definition of mid-major. With that said, this class of 2013 is a very, very strong recruiting class. UMass can be a very solid program in the A-10. We are the State University of Massachusetts. UMass as an institution offers a diverse student body, many academic programs and admissions wise there may be some leeway. UMass, once the program is established and the class of 2013 is juniors should be competitive for the A-10 title. Once established, the program should always be above .500 in the league (barring significant injuries) and competing for post season appearances.
Some fans and message board members have become critical of the Dribble Drive Motion Offense. Any team with 6 newcomers who play such significant roles (not counting Putney for the time being) in a rotation are sure to have growing pains. These players need time to adjust to college, college basketball or simply adjust to the offense that is something new to all of them. I also think it is important to note that freshman, generally are inconsistent. So after some games, fans will be calling for more of player X and less of player Y. The next night, it may look as though we need more of player Y and less of player X. This is the nature of a young team depending upon freshman and newcomers to play significant roles.
While I stress patience with the players, I also stress patience with Coach Kellogg. Let’s give him time to coach and recruit before we (the hardest of hardcore UMass Basketball fans) get too critical. Not only is Derek improving as a new, young head coach, but he is also working hard and we need to give him time for his recruits to become juniors and seniors.
If we all really want to be helpful we’ll all be positive. We'll buy tickets to the games, encourage others to buy tickets, we’ll go to high school and prep school games wearing UMass hats, sweatshirts and jackets (may I suggest this weekend: http://www.newenglandrecruitingreport.com/events/event/4/-National-Prep-Showcase.php). Let’s help create a buzz and a great college basketball atmosphere surrounding the team and University. This is the type of thing that is attractive to a high school prospect. Let’s be honest, right now recruits are taking a great leap of faith in joining Coach Kellogg's program. Prospects dream of playing in sold out arenas, not a 40% full house with virtually no student presence. Let’s try and do our part. |
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PTrainXL Junior
Joined: 14 Feb 2009 Posts: 444
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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| The crowds will come when the wins start coming. We are not Indiana who can stay in top ten in attendance and win six games. We win, they will come out and support them. Its the nature of the beast, if a team is losing and there is a game on a wednesday night people will go to guitar dudes instead of the game. I agree with patience these guys are young. I had hope for this season, and still do, it will come. He is bringing in the right guys, I just hope he grabs one of those freakish centers that swats everything, love those guys. |
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shovelhd Hall of Fame

Joined: 29 Dec 2004 Posts: 4181
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:57 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, PTrain, every team needs a good freak.
BT, all good sentiments and I agree with what you say, but you should keep it in perspective. Some great players came through here. This program achieved Final Four success, only to have it taken away by what the masses view as scandal. TF brought it back to respectability, then he punted. Last year was a train wreck. This year is full of hope and promise for the future, but let's face it, we have a sophomore head coach and a bunch of new and young players. It would take a miracle to get to the dance this year. To most of the people on this board, UMass is their alma mater. They take pride in their school, and they want to get their swagger back. That comes with tournament appearances, not nice efforts and improvements. So I can understand their impatience and their need to vent about players, coaches, the system, and what they think should happen. We all need to be patient with each other and recognize the time, effort, and support that the long term fans have given this program.
I'm not saying you're not doing this, I'm just saying. |
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PTrainXL Junior
Joined: 14 Feb 2009 Posts: 444
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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| I think we all agree on the freak center, we need somebody who is a presence and people fear to drive the lane. Papa lo COULD have, but he had project written all over him. Anyways, Richmond lost to William and Mary, things could be worse. I will tell you this, Cornell is better than W&M maybe UCF is too. |
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BTHoops Junior

Joined: 10 Jan 2004 Posts: 348
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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| shovelhd wrote: | Yeah, PTrain, every team needs a good freak. :lol:
BT, all good sentiments and I agree with what you say, but you should keep it in perspective. Some great players came through here. This program achieved Final Four success, only to have it taken away by what the masses view as scandal. TF brought it back to respectability, then he punted. Last year was a train wreck. This year is full of hope and promise for the future, but let's face it, we have a sophomore head coach and a bunch of new and young players. It would take a miracle to get to the dance this year. To most of the people on this board, UMass is their alma mater. They take pride in their school, and they want to get their swagger back. That comes with tournament appearances, not nice efforts and improvements. So I can understand their impatience and their need to vent about players, coaches, the system, and what they think should happen. We all need to be patient with each other and recognize the time, effort, and support that the long term fans have given this program.
I'm not saying you're not doing this, I'm just saying. |
If we are all true long term fans, we should be able to be patient. UMass will still be our alma mater in two or three years. UMass is NOT making post season play this year. Heck, we have won one A10 tournament game since 2001. |
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78 Hall of Fame

Joined: 02 Apr 2003 Posts: 2358
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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The big question I continue to have is this: How long will DK be able to recruit solid kids to UMass if the team continues to lose? At some point, don't kids start saying, "I know I can get playing time there, but why would I go to a team that is a consistent loser?" I have no idea, but it just seems at some point that might start to happen. An 8-10 win season this year is not going to help recruiting and right now DK has one kid signed for next year, Maxie Esho -- although I am not sure exactly how many slots will be open next season. _________________ It's better to burn out than to fade away |
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PTrainXL Junior
Joined: 14 Feb 2009 Posts: 444
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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^
Thats a very good point. I think if next year is a bust it will be tough to recruit. If there is improvement, that could excite recruits. In the long run, some guys want PT right away and will play at a lesser school to get that run. Guys like Vinson who are so highly ranked will not come though with continued losing. Atleast we are doing things the right way no trouble (wiggins is gone), and no recruiting scandals. I think good things will come, DK will bring in good talent and improve as coach. |
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farkdogg Sophomore

Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 139 Location: New York, NY
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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| PTrainXL wrote: | | The crowds will come when the wins start coming. We are not Indiana who can stay in top ten in attendance and win six games. We win, they will come out and support them. Its the nature of the beast, if a team is losing and there is a game on a wednesday night people will go to guitar dudes instead of the game. I agree with patience these guys are young. I had hope for this season, and still do, it will come. He is bringing in the right guys, I just hope he grabs one of those freakish centers that swats everything, love those guys. |
The crowds will come? Come on, that's clearly not true. We didnt have large crowds even those 2 good years w/ Travis Ford. _________________ You Can't Stop The Tower of Babul!!! |
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UMass010 Junior
Joined: 28 Dec 2008 Posts: 449
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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I am not concerned about the play of the offense by any means, they just need to grasp things defensively. The offense will take its course, but defense is where they need to come together. Kentucky is going through the offensive troubles themselves. Granted they have better talent than we do and can rely on that alone to win ball games, but 22 turnovers against Sam Houston State is pretty assuring to know that the offense takes time. They shot a great percent from the floor, but with the amount of turnovers I am sure they would have substituted for missed shots.
Going to be another long year, but progress will continue to show. |
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LooneyGoon Junior
Joined: 23 Mar 2004 Posts: 727
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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| 78 wrote: | | The big question I continue to have is this: How long will DK be able to recruit solid kids to UMass if the team continues to lose? At some point, don't kids start saying, "I know I can get playing time there, but why would I go to a team that is a consistent loser?" I have no idea, but it just seems at some point that might start to happen. An 8-10 win season this year is not going to help recruiting and right now DK has one kid signed for next year, Maxie Esho -- although I am not sure exactly how many slots will be open next season. |
I think all college coaches should be given 1 recruiting cycle (4 classes of their own) before anyone seriously calls for them to be canned.
Fact is, Travis left DK with very, very little. Give DK his 1 cycle and I think this program will be in great shape. Although this year could be frustrating to begin with, but once these kids mature, were gonna be alright. |
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PTrainXL Junior
Joined: 14 Feb 2009 Posts: 444
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Posted: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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| farkdogg wrote: | | PTrainXL wrote: | | The crowds will come when the wins start coming. We are not Indiana who can stay in top ten in attendance and win six games. We win, they will come out and support them. Its the nature of the beast, if a team is losing and there is a game on a wednesday night people will go to guitar dudes instead of the game. I agree with patience these guys are young. I had hope for this season, and still do, it will come. He is bringing in the right guys, I just hope he grabs one of those freakish centers that swats everything, love those guys. |
The crowds will come? Come on, that's clearly not true. We didnt have large crowds even those 2 good years w/ Travis Ford. |
Not going to lie, those were not really that good of years. They were exciting to watch, and also extremely inconsistent. Granted they were the best we have seen in a LONG time. Tournament bid is what will seal it, granted this may be a little out of the realm now but a national ranking. |
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OutlawPete Junior

Joined: 01 Oct 2009 Posts: 542 Location: UMass, live in Macungie, PA
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Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 12:22 am Post subject: |
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PT is exactly right. A tournament bid is the magic spark that will get the crowds back to the Mullins Center. When students are filling out their brackets and see Massachusetts, they wont believe it and will start going to the games. Some might even realize we are Division 1  _________________ Minutemen Nation |
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Chemical Ali Junior

Joined: 10 Apr 2003 Posts: 744
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Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 1:29 am Post subject: |
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| LooneyGoon wrote: |
Fact is, Travis left DK with very, very little. |
You mean other than a winning attitude, a clear style of play and a solid nucleus of players? UMass was coming off 25 wins and the NIT Championship game and returned the school's all time assist leader, a shooting guard who averaged 18 ppg, a highly touted ACC transfer, and a guy who turned out to almost make the Lakers. It's perfectly reasonable to support DK or blame Ford for bailing on the program, but placing the current struggles on Ford doesn't exactly square with reality. _________________ "Time is going really, really, really, really slow. What's the score of the Red Wings game?" |
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LooneyGoon Junior
Joined: 23 Mar 2004 Posts: 727
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Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 6:10 am Post subject: |
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^
- A guy who almost made the Lakers? Tony Gaffney was absolutely invisible his career at UM before his SR year.
- Lowe, love him. Acted like a baby with a new bottle in the dribble drive.
- Ricky is Ricky.
- Anthony Gurley is a typical ACC transfer "money guard". How frustrating was it to watch Forbes try to take over games....
- Ford left at the perfect time for HIS career and left UM with very little. The 7, SEVEN, player class he had. That either builds a program or....ummm.....well were seeing it NOW.
Give DK a cycle. |
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ktabz16 Hall of Fame

Joined: 20 Dec 2004 Posts: 6593 Location: frozen tundra of ME
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Posted: Fri Nov 20, 2009 7:12 am Post subject: |
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| DK doesn't bring in the five freshmen this year without tford. also, i disagree with ford leaving DK very little. last year was awful but we underachieved and should have won more based on talent. |
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